Sorry, David. Hazard of composing off-line and faulty memory. Seems to have brought back a few nostalgic memories though.

Just having five minutes before getting busy in the garden (the sheep in the field below us will probably be more active than the twenty two over paid donkeys in SA) I have been called many things (some justified, some not) but the only Norman I am or was related too could out drink and out swear most people. He was also a hopeless gambler, which I found out to my cost, when I met him at the dog track while I was home on leave. Thanks to his advice, neither of us had enough left for the bus fare, so we both had to walk home.

To put my comments in context: I have a Bremshey Orbit Control. It’s a beautiful machine, big, robust and stable, and a Which? best buy. I use it maybe a dozen times a year, partly because of lack of time but also because it is boring to use, even listening to music or story tapes.

In your position, I would follow Norman’s advice and try one out in a gym first: but try it for 10 or 15 sessions, then see how you feel.

Spot on David tis a simple case of each to there own.
But my joy at being outside no matter what the state of weather or light conditions is fuelled by the fact that I spend between 8 to 12 hours a day working inside with noisy machinery and the thought of being couped up during my leisure time and paying for the supposed privilidge just has no appeal to me.

Wish it would cool down a bit though for my 22 mile cycle home from work, in fact a nice cooling shower of rain would be good ;-)

Happy exercising folks however you do it

John, Having just got back from a twenty plus cycle ride every thing looks great, no need for gym's or good quality outdoor clothing etc, etc but come January / February I will welcome the comfort of a nice warm indoor area, where I can push tired limbs to the limit but then on the Sunday / Saturday I will be dressed to the nines in Gortex and boots with a good torch in my pack taking part in "Thats Lyth" or "The Anglezarke" and I will enjoy them as much as the Spinning and Tai Chi class that I did dureing the week whatever the weather.
For me the indoor compliments the out door and I would miss either one, It's a bit like the Walker / Runner argument, Both have their places in our Assocation and we would be the poorer with out both of them.

Oh yes I forgot to say that I find that the modern headtorches allow me to carry on my outdoor penchant for off road walking/running all year round, ok I am lucky where I live as I have Scout Scar and Cunswick Fell, the river Kent etc on my Doorstep and there is nothing nicer than being up on one of those hills before or after daylight looking down on the town and heading away from the light pollution that surrounds it.

I am not adverse to a night time trip round say Kentmere horseshoe either, again last winter threw up some fantastic full moon outings, that i would have missed in a gym.

Again just my take and I hope not offensive

David while not wishing to appear churlish I do feel that modern outdoor clothing and equipment is very efficient and up to combatting the worst that our climate can throw at us.

In fact by venturing out properly equipped in inclememt weather the benifits to both the the physical and mental state of the body is greatly enhanced e.g. there is no piece of gym equipment that can replicate the immense satisfaction and boost in confidence that is derived from say being out in ferocious weather with rain wind etc maybe in a remote area with the need to navigate.

I strongly beleive there is no such thing as bad weather just poor equipment, this last winter was fantastic, x country ski ng, a pair of kathoola`s for running/walking in clean fresh air with views to die for and the resistance training derived from making progress through deep snow was great, and for me at least a lot more appealing than spending hours in a gym that is heated to a perfect level for breeding bacteria using a piece of equipment that has recently been vacated by another person that has perspired all over it, i know that there are anti bacterial sprays and wipes availiabe to wipe the euipment but sorry I prefer to be outdoors using natures gym that is provided free.

An expression that springs to mind is that IN EVERY NEGATIVE THERE IS A POSITIVE you just need to look for it and TBH if bad weather is considered negative then it presents loads of positives.

Just my take on it and as ever each to there own and for what it is worth i do have a treadmill at home which is used occaisionally as a random time killer.

Yes it is best to be out doors but the gym and the kit in it, for instance the weights room and the different types of trainers, can be used in prolonged wet or cold weather when it is impractical to get on to the fells or in early morning sessions before it gets light or in the evening when it is dark by 16:30. (I like a session in the weights room between 07:00 and 09:00 in the winter, followed by a walk up or down the Eden).

I am firmly in Eltons camp, there really is no substitute for being out in the fresh air on varied terrain giving the body a thorough and varied workout.

two very interesting but different replys. it`s given me something to think about.thank you.

The main problem is that they are incredibly boring to use. Use one if you have an injury, but otherwise stick to the real thing.

Before buying, why not go down to the local gym several times over a few weeks and try one out to see if it suits you. This is cheaper and better than buying, as they are a big bulky item and a good one costs an arm and a leg. (One tip. I always use my IPod in the gym as I hate the racket produced by the gyms music system)

Does any one use a cross trainer/elliptical trainer for training? as I`m thinking of buying one and I would be greatful for any advise/comments.
Thank you.
Paul.